Author Topic: [CLOSED]AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen  (Read 2414 times)

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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[CLOSED]AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« on: 14 January, 2015, 09:47:28 PM »
By the power given to me by Our King and with sole intention to protect the order and follow the laws of Kingdom of Saxony, High Court by own initiative start this prosecution against crimes committed by Marius Von Schliefen, subject of Kingdom of Saxony.

I give the ground to Prosecution represented by Martin Wagner, Chancellor of the Kingdom, to present accusation against the Defendant. This must be done in 24 hours.

For Defendant  24 hours are given to find a lawyer who will represent him in this session. If he fail to do so Defendant will must defend by himself.
« Last Edit: 20 January, 2015, 12:18:54 AM by Ernst Weber »

(RIP) Marius Von Schliefen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #1 on: 14 January, 2015, 10:58:03 PM »
'Honorable' Judge,
it's been almost 12 hours that me and my men were restrained within our own lands, which you and your band of rouges have illegally taken from us by force - an act opposing the very same law you're trying to represent right now - and you still refuse, although prompted manifold, to present the crimes we are being charged with!
In the good habit of your own legal system back 'home' and according to the proceedings presented by your side, also before this very court, I call upon your duty to formally stick to trial procedures, with state:
Quote from: wiki
Also the Judge of the Kingdom where the trial is taking place must use the in-game functions of the Court House building menu to create the Crime Procedure. In the form he needs to fill out:

    The name of the Defendant
    A summary of the crime(s) he is accused of
    The URL link to the Trial

In addition you have summoned the accused before the court in Kiev.
Presupposed your permission to quote your 'invitation' as evidence of your appearent difficulties in conducting a lawful litigation, your words were:
Quote
From: Ernst Weber
Sent on: 14-Jan-1315, 20:57:08
Sent to: Marius Von Schliefen

You are called to the court of Kiev to answer to accusation in violating of Saxony laws.

This is the link to the court session: http://rpforum.medieval-europe.eu/index.php/topic,11832.0.html
I may remind you that the court of Kiev has no authority over the people of Saxony, neither does it wield jurisdiction over Saxon law.

I also challenge the restrains themselves for the person having issued them should have been sent to the facility in Pinsk yesterday.
As a simple result of a system failure, which was reported to the authorities well in time but not properly resolved, he was not.

Until the cause for this idleness and it's subsequent result has been clarified and rectified I recommend to the people of Saxony to make use of their privilege to refuse to give evidence!
« Last Edit: 14 January, 2015, 11:55:31 PM by Marius Von Schliefen »

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #2 on: 15 January, 2015, 12:05:54 AM »
Dear Defendant,

We are here not to hear yours defenition for right and wrong. In this court such definition are in competence of the Judge.

Accusations will be presented by Prosecutor, as it is established by precident in cases of my preancestor which were sanctioned by highest authority as acceptable. Here is an example:

Quite, please. Court is in session.

Summond before this court is Martin Wagner for offences against the law.

Representig the prosecution: Constable Caelestis Decmon

The accused may represent himself or appoint an atturney. May he please announce his decision.

Also I see no reasons to freze this court sesion. If such demand will be deposited by highest authority we will honor it.

So you have 22 hours to find someone to represent you in court if you wish to.

(RIP) Marius Von Schliefen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #3 on: 15 January, 2015, 12:38:45 AM »
Thank you for sharing your immencely rich treasure trove of experience with this man, your 'Honor'!
Assumingly we are not here to hear anyones 'definitions' but your own!
Considering that the nature of their crimes was not only presented to the defendants in their call before the court but it was also obvious to them and the entire interested world these days, I only requested an answer to the reasons you hold me and my companions hostage of your ferocious attempt of taking revenge.
A rather reasonable request which you still choose to ignore.

And may I point out that I have not requested you to suspend this trial. I've given up reasoning with your kind quite some time ago..
As a matter of fact, I actually take a great amount of joy in this occasion of you revealing your true nature to the audience!

So, by commonly known, orderly proceedings I will carefully make use of my right to appoint an attorney within 24h of the announcement of the crimes I'm being charged with.
Or are you depriving me of that right as well?

(RIP) Martin Wagner

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #4 on: 15 January, 2015, 08:54:30 AM »
Your Honor,

To avoid problems previous judge has with court sesion performing because of incompetence and lack of knowladge abour court procedure I plad this court sesion to be proceded as example for strict following the rules.

I will also take freedom to answer some questions Defendants has about procedures, and ask you for pardon if you prefer to do so personaly.

As it is stated here: http://wiki.medieval-europe.eu/index.php?title=The_Trial there is a tree steps to open court procedure.

I. If so the Judge then opens that trial in the appropriate Kingdom Court of Law sub-forum.

It is done as we can see here.

II . He would then notify both the Defendant and the Prosecutor via PM of the trial along with a URL link to the pertinent trial post.

It is done. All accused receive a letter:

Quote
Subject: Call to court

Text: Dear Sir,

You are called to the court of Kiev to answer to accusation in violating of Saxony laws.

This is the link to the court session: (URL of court session)

This text is provided to us from our collegue from Kiev so there was a understandable copy-paste error with mentioning court of Kiev. But it is acceptable  because the main goal of letter is to inform accused about opened court session and providing hiwm with URL (something previous Judge fail to do according case archives)

III. Also the Judge of the Kingdom where the trial is taking place must use the in-game functions of the Court House building menu to create the Crime Procedure. In the form he needs to fill out:

    The name of the Defendant
    A summary of the crime(s) he is accused of
    The URL link to the Trial

Once submitted, the Judge can go back to the Court menu to view and administer the Crime Procedure.


All trials was opened in Court building in game. I dont know why defendants think that they must be visible for them, but if it so they must report to admin technical malfunction. Cases are opened in game in 10 minutes period after forum topics are created and administration can check and confirm it.

Now , your honor, I would like to plead for procedural issue. I see that you wish to combain two phases of court :

Quote
1: Starting the Trial:

The Judge starts the Trial. He must present the Defendant and the Prosecutor and ask them if they want to appoint an Attorney (Defense) or a Barrister (Prosecution).

The Defendant and the Prosecutor must declare if they want to appoint someone or not, and tell the Judge who they are appointing.
Also, if the Defendant and the Prosecutor can’t find lawyers and can’t speak the native language of the Judge or of the other Parts, they can ask to have a “Basic English” trial, so that it could be understood using common translating tools.
This whole step must be done within 24 hours from the Judge’s opening post.

and

Quote
2: Opening remarks by the Prosecution:

The Prosecution should open the trial with a presentation of the facts of the case, and a listing of what laws were broken by the Defendant. All evidence should be presented at this time and may take the form of a Screenshot (see sidebar).
The Prosecution can call up to two Witnesses, who will present their witness.
This whole step must be done within 24 hours from the Prosecutor post.

I ask you to not do so , as I say previously, because of my wish this court session to be an exemplar. I ask you for permision to have my 24 hours to present my accusation only after Defendant name his lawyer or state thet he will defend by himself.

I hope my plead will be accepted.


(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #5 on: 16 January, 2015, 06:03:51 PM »
As the procedure was freezed by highest authority I will give to all defenders 6 more hours to name their lawyer if the want. If they dont court will expect from them to defend themselves.

(RIP) Marius Von Schliefen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #6 on: 16 January, 2015, 07:24:12 PM »
I name Götz von Berlichingen as my legal representation.

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #7 on: 16 January, 2015, 08:45:01 PM »
Defendant name for his lawyer citizen Götz v.Berlichingen. From this moment he has the right to speak in this session. If in any moment Defendant decide to stop using a lawyer and continue to defend himself he will need to contact me.

Prosecution have 24 hours from this moment to present accusations against the Defendant.

(RIP) Martin Wagner

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #8 on: 17 January, 2015, 10:19:10 PM »
Your Honor,

On 8 Nov 1314 AD Kingdom of Saxony, ruled by Marius Von Schliefen, declare a war to Grand Principality of Kiev. This is the date was the beginning of the most terrible period in history of Saxony. Ex-king Marius become an enemy of mighty and resourceful country populated with brave and pride people, and with this act make whole Saxony a target for their vengeance, especially after conquering of kievan province Pinsk with its population. All this acts of Marius`s government was not provoked in any way from peoples of Kiev. As Marius himself state in his letter to His Majesty king Radost , he start this war because he have some issues with Prussia. The connection between issues Saxony-Prussia and aggression against Kievan territory is unclear. But outcomes from this actions are very clear - religious riots, repressions for over 50% of saxonian population, creating of concentration camp in Pinsk, and in the end revolution.

All this create suffering and inconveniences for all people of Saxony - those who live here many years in peace and serenity and those  who become citizens of Saxony in result of Saxon aggression.

In this Prosecution see a violation of National Security Act, as all actions of Marius`s, and after that Herald`s government have as result disturbance of the peace and internal security of Saxony.

Defendant Marius Von Schliefen was king of Saxony, who drag the country in unnecessary war  and member of Reichstag. 

As a king and member of Reichstag of his and Harold`s government ,we are sure ,he personally participate in all inhuman and unrightful decision taken by previous government.

Also when peoples of Saxony, when their patience came to the end, rose up against the hated ruler, Marius Von Schliefen was at the forefront of the defense of the tyrant. The prosecution believes that only the partners of the king in his nefarious deeds against the people dared to raise a hand against the ordinary people who want to restore justice, peace and serenity in the country.

Prosecution have indirect evidences which allow us to suspect that Marius Von Schliefen try to organize a contre-revolution for reestablishing Harold`s tyrannical rule in Saxony.

All this allow Prosecution to believe that  Marius Von Schliefen is guilty in violation of National Security Act. Prosecution ask maximum punishment to Defendant - 1000 sp fine and 3 days imprisonment.

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #9 on: 18 January, 2015, 12:07:37 AM »
Lord Martin,

You are late with over 1 hours. This is unacceptable and I will not tolerate this in future. I understand that weekend is a time for children and family but you must remember that every hour you late is stolen from the time for family of those who wait final verdict under restrain.

So I give the ground for Defence. Citizen Götz v.Berlichingen can present his plead.

For beeing late Prosecutor must pay 46 sp compensation to Defendant after all trials are finished.

(RIP) Götz v.Berlichingen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #10 on: 18 January, 2015, 09:29:59 AM »
Your Honor,
Mr. Wagner,
my fellow Saxons,

what we've been presented here, by the travailing prosecutor, is merely any evidence of former King Marius having actively violated any current Saxon law at all. In fact, his words testify von Schliefens constant struggle to improve the well-being of the people of Saxony!

Actions that result in possible re-actions which potentially result in somebody else committing a vague crime based on evidence heard through the grapevine and 'indirect evidence' still concealed from the auditory should not suffice to condemn a man for treason and justify the penalty applied for by the prosecution!

If it is the intention of the prosecution to codemn a man for being loyal and true towards King and Kingdom and serving at his best executing the office he's been burdened with than I challenge you you show me one good man on this world!
The simple fact alone that you do not coincide with his methods doesn't make them a crime.

As member of the government former King Marius surely had no intentions, whatsoever, of weakening or destabilizing the former, nor had he ever disturbed the inner peace of the realm. Whatever unresolved personal issues may stand between the accused and Mr. Wagner are not subject for the public to solve!

Since no sign or evidence for a crime has been presented I don't see any reason at all as to why charges against him should be held up or why former King Marius should be held captive any longer and I suggest releasing him immediately and request compensation for his losses.

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #11 on: 18 January, 2015, 11:51:53 PM »
Citizen Götz v.Berlichingen, from prosecutor`s remarks I understand that defender is accused in taking several decisions with no logical ground which lead to several event and in result worsening of kingdom stability and inner peace. But I do not understand nothing from your words exept that Defendant "surely" has no bad intentions.

As a lawyer I think you must prove that some kind of events or reasons force Defendant to take this desicion, not to declare your hope that he has no intentions to do anything wrong. I hope you do so in your closing remarks.

As for me I wish to hear defendant side of the story how his issues with Prussia lead to attacking of Pinsk. I hope to hear the answer in Defendant closing remarcs.

Now Prosecution have his 24 hours for closng remarks.

(RIP) Götz v.Berlichingen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #12 on: 19 January, 2015, 12:52:33 AM »
Your Honor,

aside from polemic, personal recentment and empty accusations the prosecutor has brought up nothing that would incriminate with any crime. To my knowledge he never bore a pickaxe to destroy what he built up with his own hands and I have not seen any evidence prooving different.

The prosecutor appearently referes to a chain of events that was caused by regular state affairs for which my client, as King, was - naturally enough - a relevant authority. But other than that I see not what his crime should be!
From what I heard about the phrasing of 'logical' from the prosecution's side I am convinced another debate will lead nowhere.

I urge you to not let yourself get drawn down the line of issuing vedicts upon the 'cause and effect'-question.
If you wish to know how events in Prussia let to political decisions I am sure Marius von Schliefen will explain to you in detail via pm, since that goes even beyond the scope of this trial.

(RIP) Ernst Weber

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #13 on: 19 January, 2015, 01:15:14 AM »
Götz v.Berlichingen,

I am tired to fight your lack of descipline with food, so yiou are fined  for 100 sp. You can give your explanation in your turn then I give you the ground. If you have any procedural remarcs or anything else , as I say previously, you can send them to me by pm. I hope I will not be froced to return to this topic again.

Quote
Whoever speaks without permission can be fined 100 silver coins at the Judge's discretion, and they could be even punished for breaking forum rules.

(RIP) Götz v.Berlichingen

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Re: AZ: 1314/031 The people against Marius Von Schliefen
« Reply #14 on: 19 January, 2015, 02:09:11 AM »
Dear Mr. 30-days-old-snooty-nosed-little-upstart Weber,
exactly the opposite is true!

We've been playing along for the sake of the game with your little charade of set-up trials until this point.
But this court has significantly violated proceedured all along these trials and I intended to present my charges to this court in my final speech. But since you insist on stretching the restrains way over every limit and keep prohibiting my person from orderly conducting my defence at every given chance I will request other institutions to put an end to this farce.

I accuse you of holding fake trials with no substance at all only to intimidate my clients and everybody involved.

I have carefully documented all your failures and those of the prosecution and will present them to the honorable masters of the Supreme Court to have you answer to them,  leaving it to their valued judgement to resolve these cases.

It's a pitty to watch you fail even on this level of the game but, to be blunt, noone was expecting any different from you to begin with.