Medieval-Europe Role Play Forum

RP - International => [English] Town Crier => Topic started by: Fabiotto Borgia on 30 December, 2019, 08:51:47 PM

Title: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Fabiotto Borgia on 30 December, 2019, 08:51:47 PM
I believe that in the history of this Medieval Europe many have happened to have been baptized without too many explanations.
The first time I became theological, I asked a theological priest: "Father, can you baptize me?" and he replied: "Of course! Tomorrow morning at 10 am be found in the city where my church is located".
After many years and after many episodes I decided to become a mystic and turned to an Ottoman Imam. "Imam, can you baptize me?" and he replied: "Of course! Tomorrow evening at 7 am be found in the city where my temple is located".
Then I became an Imam. A Scottish community asked me, "Imam, can you baptize us?" and I replied: "Of course! Tomorrow let everyone find you in my temple"  and so many others did.
Massimo da Vinci was recently named Imam of Suez. Massimo da Vinci, a conductor far from the recent disagreements that have been held in Europe.
Massimo da Vinci, a merchant. Massimo da Vinci, an adventurer. And now Massimo da Vinci, the Imam, who thought of doing good by allowing two atheist citizens to become mystics, thinking in good faith to help two players who still manage to write in the game to ask for a baptism. Goods increasingly rare, which we will probably see less and less.
These two citizens have made wrong choices, but I certainly don't judge.
You need to be able to see everything, and not just what could be convenient. Many see "two enemies" become mystical. I see two people now living in a Kingdom where there is a mystical church without Imam.
I met one of these people in the game. He was a cardinal and always tried to play while maintaining his role. Often he turned to Theos when he finished his letters.
Now my question is, won't these two people ever play again? Will they have to be completely eliminated from a game they have shown they love? Are the two of them the real enemies?
As a Grand Imam I would like to be aware of everything, but this is not always the case. And I can't even pretend to be notified by every single player for every single move. Everyone puts the effort that succeeds in this game, and the commitment of Massimo da Vinci has been to make two people happy.
May the One who must never be named bless you all

Credo che, nella storia di questa Europa Medievale, sia capitato a molti di essere stati battezzati senza troppe spiegazioni.
La prima volta che sono diventato teologico, ho chiesto ad un prete teologico: "Padre, puoi battezzarmi?" e lui mi rispose: "Certo! Domani mattina alle ore 10 fatti trovare nella città dove si trova la mia chiesa".
Poi decisi di diventare mistico e mi rivolsi ad un Imam ottomano. "Imam, puoi battezzarmi?" e lui mi rispose: " Certo! Domani sera alle 7 fatti trovare nella città dove si trova il mio tempio".
Poi sono diventato Imam. Una comunità scozzese mi chiese: "Imam, puoi battezzarci?" ed io risposi: "Certo! Domani fatevi trovare tutti nel mio tempio"
Di recente Massimo da Vinci è stato nominato Imam di Suez. Massimo da Vinci, un condotterio lontano dai recenti screzi che si sono tenuti in Europa. 
Massimo da Vinci, un mercante. Massimo da Vinci, un avventuriero. Ed ora Massimo da Vinci, l'Imam, che ha pensato di fare cosa buona concedendo a due cittadini atei di diventare mistici, pensando in buona fede di aiutare due giocatori che ancora riescono a scrivere in gioco per chiedere un battesimo. Merce sempre più rara, che probabilmente vedremo sempre meno.
Questi due cittadini hanno fatto scelte sbagliate, ma sicuramente non giudico.
Bisogna saper vedere tutto, e non solo quello che potrebbe fare comodo. In molti vedono "due nemici" diventati mistici. Io vedo due persone che ora vivono in un Regno dove si trova una chiesa mistica senza Imam.
Una di queste persone l'ho conosciuta in gioco. Era un cardinale e cercava sempre di giocare mantenendo il suo ruolo. Spesso si rivolgeva a Theos quando concludeva le sue lettere.
Ora la mia domanda è: queste due persone non dovranno giocare mai più? Dovranno essere completamente eliminate da un gioco cui loro hanno dimostrato di amare? Sono forse loro due i veri nemici?
Come Gran Imam mi piacerebbe essere al corrente di tutto, ma non sempre è così. E non posso neanche pretendere di essere avvisato da ogni singolo giocatore per ogni singola mossa. Ognuno mette l'impegno che riesce in questo gioco, e l'impegno di Massimo da Vinci è stato quello di rendere felici due persone.
Che Colui che non deve mai essere nominato, vi benedica tutti
Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Alfred Avalon on 01 January, 2020, 05:02:36 PM
I find this explanation rather interesting and in need of response.

I can, perhaps, understand someone being unaware of current events (though that does smell of irresponsibility).

Our English clergy also have the generous spirit of helping others and perform many initiations into the faith, however, not one of them is unaware of the situations that surround them. The responsibility of keeping clergy effectively informed falls on those above them in the hierarchy, both religious and civil, to the extent each of the two apply.

Our English clergy are shepherds. A shepherd will risk life and limb to protect and care for the sheep, but the wolf will find nothing but pain and severe bodily injury at the hand of the same shepherd. It is a shepherd's job to know the difference between sheep and wolf. If he fails at this, he may lose his sheep! He may even lose himself.

The two individuals in question have definitively proven they are wolves. They have not merely been "caught up in events," they have willfully and deliberately taken active roles in those same events. You speak of their supposed "love of the game," but I see many who truly did love this game until the destruction wrought by these two and their group caused that love to melt away and die.

No one eliminates another from the game. It is improper to even suggest that another be eliminated, save in the most extreme of situations. No, such things are not so. No one eliminates anyone but himself. Those who lost their love of this game because of the individuals in question and their group were not eliminated by that group. They, ultimately, eliminated themselves.

I did not make these two enemies of the world. They did that themselves by their own choices and their own actions. How can I say they don't desire to play the part of a fugitive and exile? And if this is their desire, should I not play my part also?

It is choices that make men. It is also choices that break men.

They made their choices. I have made mine. The Norse have made theirs. Soon the Theological Inquisition (in which both may be excommunicated in effigy) will make their choices also.

I am appalled by your choice to defend the morally bankrupt. I am also appalled by your choice not to organize your communication effectively enough to render your clergy reasonably informed.

The celebration of the new year is a time to reflect on the choices we have made. It is a marked opportunity to choose to make better choices, though we always have that opportunity. Take the opportunity. Make better choices.

Happy New Year.
Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Fabiotto Borgia on 01 January, 2020, 06:45:34 PM
Dear King Alfred
I want to specify that I am not defending anything or anyone.
You wrote me a letter asking for explanations and I replied in the most transparent way possible by writing both privately and visibly throughout Europe and I did it because if you have dedicated your time to writing to me, then it is right that I give you all the possible attention.
With much respect and esteem.
Even for me it was a real surprise to read those news and as I said before I would like to be able to know everything in advance but this is not always the case.
Someone turned to the youngest and most unaware of the Imams present and this Imam granted baptism, but I assure you that he would have granted it to anyone, even to the most aggressive and violent of all warriors. Furthermore, a person who has never been present in any war but took refuge in the Ottoman Empire to live in peace.
Do you remember when together we were looking for a solution to carry out the project of a small mystical community in your kingdom?
We had many difficulties because we didn't always have the answers we were waiting for. Then we decided (I speak on my side) not to respect the rules and build a mystical temple in Northampton so as not to waste any more time and go ahead with our plans and our adventures. And also because a King of a Kingdom as important as yours has so many things to do every day. I am very sorry to hear from you that you are "upset by my choice not to organize communication to inform my clergy" since you should have understood that neither I nor everyone else knew anything. You told me that people have been excommunicated by the Norse, perhaps invoking me directly to do it, but it is not I who deal with excommunications and I honestly do not think that my mystical faith does not give anyone a chance.
What happened happened very quickly and happened because someone was enthusiastic about doing their homework as an Imam.
One of the most important pillars of the mystical faith is conversion, and I also deal with that. Of course I do not put the knife on anyone's throat, and you, my dear and wise friend, know it well since we have had more than one friendly conversation about it, just as you have had with other imams and I guess you know well our goodwill and our respect for anyone.
I remind you that, if this is your fear or your fear, a mystic can be treated in war only by an Imam. If these two people were at war against you and treated by an Imam then you would be right to be angry with my community.
It seems to me that your current pope, Luke II, had treated soldiers of your own faith in war and in retaliation it was the whole theological faith that paid for the consequences.
I hope from the bottom of my heart that episodes like the one we lived (once I was theological too) mark us and help us become better people. Or at least help us choose friends with the right heart.
I do my best as an Imam, just as you did your best when you were a priest. I still remember you needed faith points and you asked for them at the church of Cyrene and Cyrene sent you some (I think it was you, or maybe I'm wrong, he was an English citizen by the way)
If your fear or annoyance is of political origin, then I am not the person who must speak to you.
I, as Grand Imam, can only speak to you of the One who cannot be named and who in the beginning was only heaven and earth and The Unnamed felt lonely. And  he created the woman and the man.
I wish you my friend a happy new year.
I invite you to speak with my Primodor, of whom I am only a humble servant
I hope to come to England soon and visit your beautiful capital once again

Caro Re Alfred
Voglio precisare che io non difendo niente e nessuno.
Tu mi hai scritto una lettera chiedendo spiegazioni ed io ti ho risposto nel modo più trasparente possibile scrivendo sia privatamente che visibilmente in tutta Europa e l'ho fatto perchè se hai dedicato il tuo tempo a scrivermi, allora è giusto che io ti dia tutta l'attenzione possibile.
Per rispetto e per stima.
Anche per me è stata una vera sorpresa leggere quelle notizie e come ti dicevo prima mi piacerebbe poter sapere tutto in anticipo ma non sempre è così.
Qualcuno si è rivolto al più giovane e incosapevole degli Imam presenti e questo Imam ha concesso battesimo , ma ti assicuro che lo avrebbe concesso a chiunque, anche al più aggressivo e violento di tutti i guerrieri. Inoltre una persona che non è mai stata presente in nessuna guerra ma si rifugiò nell'Impero Ottomano per vivere in pace.
Ricordi quando insieme cercavamo una soluzione per poter portare avanti il progetto di una piccola comunità mistica nel tuo regno?
Abbiamo avuto tante difficoltà perchè non sempre avevamo le risposte che stavamo aspettando. Poi abbiamo deciso (parlo dalla mia parte) di non rispettare le regole e costruire un tempio mistico a Northampton per non perdere altro tempo ed andare avanti con i nostri progetti e le nostre avventure. Ed anche perchè un Re di Un Regno così importante come il tuo ha tante cose da fare ogni giorno. Mi spiace molto sentire da parte tua che sei "sconvolto dalla mia scelta di non organizzare la comunicazione per informare il mio clero" visto che dovresti aver capito che nè io nè tutti gli altri sapevano nulla. Mi hai detto che delle persone sono state scomunicate dai norreni, forse invotandomi direttamente a farlo, ma non sono io che mi occupo di scomuniche e sinceramente non credo che la mia fede mistica non dia una possibiltà a chiunque la voglia.
Quello che è accaduto è accaduto molto velocemente ed è accaduto perchè qualcuno era entusiasta di fare il suo dovere come Imam.
Uno dei più importanti pilastri della fede mistica è la conversione, ed anche io mi occupo di quella. Naturalmente non metto il coltello sulla gola di nessuno, e tu, mio caro e saggio amico, lo sai bene visto che di conversazioni amichevoli a riguardo ne abbiamo avuta più di una, così come ne hai avute con altri imam ed immagino che conosci bene la nostra buona volontà ed il nostro rispetto per chiunque.
Ti ricordo che , nel caso sia questa la tua paura o il tuo timore, un mistico può essere curato in guerra solo da un Imam. Se queste due persone si trovassero in guerra contro di te e verranno curate da un Imam allora avresti ragione ad essere arrabbiato con la mia comunità. Faccio del mio meglio come imam, proprio come hai fatto del tuo meglio quando eri un prete. Ricordo ancora che avevi bisogno di punti fede e li hai richiesti alla chiesa di Cirene e Cirene te ne ha inviato alcuni (penso che fossi tu, o forse mi sbaglio, era ancora un cittadino inglese)
Mi sembra che il tuo attuale papa, Luke II, avesse curato in guerra soldati della tua stessa fede e per ritorsione fu tutta la fede teologica a pagarne le conseguenze.
Spero dal profondo del cuore che episodi come quello che abbiamo vissuto (un tempo anche io ero teologico) ci segnino e ci aiutino a diventare persone migliori. O almeno ci aiutino a scegliere gli amici dal cuore giusto.
Se il tuo timore o il tuo fastidio è di origine politica, allora non sono io la persona che deve parlare con te.
Io, come Grand Imam, posso solo parlarti di Colui che non può essere nominato e che in principio c'era solo il cielo e la terra e L'Innominato si sentì solo. E creò l'uomo.
Auguro buon anno anche a te mio amico.
Ti invito a parlare con il mio Primodor , del quale sono solo un umile servitore
Spero di venire presto in Inghilterra e visitare ancora una volta la tua bellissima capitale

Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Alfred Avalon on 02 January, 2020, 05:03:22 PM
By vigorously defending these baptisms (which is, in fact, exactly what you have been doing this whole thread), you make it plain enough to me that these baptisms are sanctioned (albeit after the fact) by the Universal Mystic Church.

In so doing, you are broadcasting to the world that moral uprightness is not currently a prerequisite of membership into the Universal Mystic Church, as the UMC is now proudly accepting members with a well-known history of vehement and unrepentant depravity. I suspect your numbers may swell for a time. Far better to shrink.

You have also made lot of odd and inaccurate statements in the midst of this meandering discourse. I shall dismiss those straightaway without another look.

The prognosis does not look good for the UMC with this newly announced policy of embracing the wicked into its congregation.

Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Fabiotto Borgia on 02 January, 2020, 07:07:12 PM
I have already told you that I am not defending anything or anyone and that if these two have done something wrong I don't give a damn if they are arrested. And it doesn't give a damn to the other mystics either. I explained to you that the baptism happened by chance and that I do not have the power to excommunicate. I can't tell you more than that.
I thank you for worrying about the Mystical Church and as a friend I suggest you stay calm. The fact that these two people have become mystical will not affect the security of your Kingdom.
In the past, your Kingdom, your faith, your allies and the faith of your allies have had many other problems and invasions.
I remember regions in England now without resources, and an usurped allied throne.
I am sure that if two unwilling people have become mystical by accident, this only creates problems for the credibility of the mystical church.
Thanks to your interest, I will work for the mystical church to regain trust and credibility.
I thank you for your interest
I wish you all the best

Ti ho già ripetuto che non sto difendendo niente e nessuno e che se questi due hanno fatto qualcosa di sbagliato non me ne frega nulla se verranno arrestati. E non frega nulla neanche agli altri mistici.  Ti ho spiegato che il battesimo sia avvenuto per caso e che io non ho il potere di scomunicare. Più di questo non so dirti.
Ti ringrazio per preoccuparti per la Chiesa Mistica e come amico ti suggerisco di rimanere tranquillo. Il fatto che queste due persone sono diventate mistiche non intaccherà la sicurezza del tuo Regno.
In passato il tuo Regno , la tua fede , i tuoi alleati e la fede dei tuoi alleati hanno avuto ben altri problemi e invasioni.
Ricordo di regioni in Inghilterra ora senza risorse, di un trono alleato addirittura usurpato.
Sono sicuro che se due persone malvolute sono diventate mistiche per caso, questo crea problemi soltanto alla credibilità della chiesa mistica.
Grazie al tuo interesse , lavorerò affinche la chiesa mistica riaquisti fiducia e credibilità.
Ti ringrazio del tuo interessamento
Ti auguro tutto il meglio
Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Kol on 03 January, 2020, 06:29:13 AM
I am pleased that you decided to invoke England's allies and their allies ' faith.  Since you didn't desire to come right out and say "Sweden and the Norse".     Because yes, we have had issues both as a Kingdom and a faith within that Kingdom, brought on by a faction...a faction that those two people you embraced into your faith are part of.  Two people who came to Sweden as part of an invasion force. 

So embrace them.  Say what you will.  It is your choice as a leader of a faith to do such.  It isn't an easy road to walk, nor is it trying to keep clergy in line at times if basic ground rules are not established and followed.  I know this very well, as I am just now cleaning up a mess that such caused for my faith in a moment of rapid expansion. 

But, because you have embraced them ( baptized) you have officially taken on those who actively took part in the invasion of Sweden, and as such.  I have cut trade ties to Cyrene and any Kingdom that has large populations of the Mystical Church.   England and Scotland among them.   

I paid a heavy price for the actions of others in the Norse faith, you now have two of those very people that support this faction that saw the destruction of Kingdoms, tormented Kingdoms they came into power in (ask Castile)  and work on destroying temples of another faith.  All while also having taken part in the attempted destruction of the Norse faith and invasion of Sweden.  So embrace them, keep them.  But the price I put upon you for this slight against my Kingdom and the pain these two helped inflict upon it and those of the Norse faith...

No more trade with Kingdoms of the Mystic faith church and I will ask others to join in on this as well, all that have suffered from the group these two men are part of. 

Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Fabiotto Borgia on 03 January, 2020, 09:18:40 AM
Good morning to both

unfortunately I start to think that I don't know the official language well to communicate, because I thought I had repeated several times that I was not aware of these baptisms and they happened by chance, simply because two people turned to the last of the imams who is been named. An imam who has decided to come to Cyrene after having lived the last period of his life in peace and serenity in the Ottoman Empire and who is so strong the respect I feel for him that I am close to him in this period. Perhaps the only mistake was giving him the role of imam lightly, but among us it was a shame to see an unused church, and in this period we have been very busy with our families to give directions. I also invited both officially and privately to speak with Primodor, because the pillars of the mystical faith prevent me from asking for excommunication and excommunicating.
These two people did not take citizenship in Cyrene. Now because two enemies have become mystical in the way I explained to you, do you want to hit the whole mystical community? This is a modus operandi that I have already seen. And that shocked me a lot. The cyrene caliph also has unwanted people, and these unwanted people have their faith. But we were all shocked by what we have seen in the past and we treasured it.

I really Wish you both have a wonderful day
Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Eddard Stark on 03 January, 2020, 01:16:57 PM
Good morning /afternoon,

I can see not just two but A LOT of enemies among the citizens of Cyrene and followers of Mystics. I will soon call for in internal meeting to decide whether to build a barrier between Cyrene and our kingdoms.

Thank you. Happy new year.
Title: Re: Regarding recent Mystical Baptisms
Post by: Fabiotto Borgia on 03 January, 2020, 06:30:09 PM

As a Grand Imam, all I can do is condemn these baptisms done very lightly and tell you that if I had known in time I would have opposed it. I also understand your concern and am working to keep the mystical faith immaculate as it always has been.

As a diplomat, I tell you that if someone takes citizenship in Cyrene without permission, he will be tried immediately. And if they have an arrest warrant, nobody will object to their arrest in Cyrenaean territory

Daniel D'Angiò has been arrested by Cyrene's authorities in the past for taking citizenship without permission, and this link can confirm it ( (

As you can see, we are not unwary.

To the good Eddard, who spoke of "many enemies", these people have shown redemption and now they live a new life moving away completely from past events that now no longer concern them. They have never been our enemies, as you and the other
honorable people who are writing here have never been (enemies of us, I mean).
Now these people are our friends and good citizens, who commit to living by working and occasionally participate in all the activities that we organize in Cyrene to have fun.
These people are no longer enemies, even if they have been in the past. They have shown that they have changed their lifestyle and we have welcomed them. And now they have become our friends, because Cyrene's Sun warms everyone's heart.
I hope that you will open your heart and that we will find ourselves drinking together at the tournament to be held in Belgrade (I asked to be able to participate, I hope to be in time)

I remain available